And that system for her him is always evolving 100. What is true today might not be true tomorrow. In my mind, i am a living and breathing counter puncher to the reality of the day. That's a great way to say it, i'm going to keep this one.

You got it the garyvee audio experience vaynernation. How are you very excited today for a new podcast uh? It is late late, late summer, in new york city and for us east coaster. That means it's u.s open time and we have a tremendous guest today. Talking about a subject matter that i have a lot of passion, for, i grew up, loving hacking with tennis and watching it.

I still think michael chang's paris run is something i think about every time. This summer starts because i'll never forget it and uh and have been a long time fan of tennis and uh. As my career has evolved, uh i've really become friendly, with a lot of the guys and gals on the tour and enjoy it, and my guest today is one of the most significant um individuals in the sport today. Some people call him the commissioner of tennis uh and i'm excited to yap with him and really as we go on this journey of leaning into your passions and doing what you love and really mindset.

You want to talk about a sport that really leans into mindset, and even the ebbs and flows in a single match are fascinating. The highs of highs, the lows of those, as many of you know, novak joker is uh - is my favorite tennis player. I legitimately every time he's down two sets to love in a match. I go to social media and say, and now it's gon na start and he legitimately lands it for me, eight out of ten times and so uh patrick.

It's real, really a great pleasure to have you on the show. Why don't you tell everybody who you are and a little bit about yourself and then i'll get into some questions? Thank you. Gary um, i didn't know you were such a tennis fan happy to know. Um, well, i'm i'm i'm a tennis fan.

I i really. I am a tennis fan. I i fell in love with tennis. When i was four years old as a kid uh, i used to be a player when i was young, and then i had to stop tennis, because my parents thought it was not a real thing.

Yeah a too risky thing too risky. They didn't want me to take that risk and then my my life. 10 years later, my life became tennis. I be, i started my own tennis academy when i was 26 in france.

My academy became the the biggest tennis academy in europe and i started coaching and i coached a lot of. I mean a lot, a few top players and the last one that i'm still working with for now. Uh almost 10 years is serena williams. So i'm a tennis coach and then i started to do some businesses.

In tennis, my tennis academy is one and then i started to do a few others. So i would define myself as first a coach, a tennis coach, a coach in general, because i think coaching is uh is helping people achieve their their potential and i think, whether it's tennis or anything else, it's we're kind of doing the same. The same job and uh and i'm also a businessman - let's go to the beginning - why at four you saw it on the telly. No, my parents, it was the 70s in the seventies.

Tennis was big, huge huge. We had the borg mcenroe chris abbott connors chris everett navratilova, it was tennis, was huge, so my parents, like many other people, started to play tennis. They were not young but uh, they started to play and they were going to the club. Every weekend the club became our weekend yeah second home.

We can second home totally and i was with other kids and we were hacking. We started to play yeah right and i thought and were you good at it right away? Yeah? I was good yeah. Actually, i was as a kid i was. I was suffering a lot from a lot of problems, including very severe shyness, a lot of anxiety crisis at night and the tennis court was the only place where i felt good.

I felt confident i felt i was worth something also because i was bad at school. I was struggling everywhere and the tennis tennis saved my life also because that was the only place where i was somebody, and i was worth something in the way that i want to start to evolve my podcast a little bit. I want to jump in here. You know listening to patrick right now, literally, what was going through.

My brain was that's what business was for me. I wasn't shy, but i was incredibly emotionally charged. I i i was so empathetic and so competitive that i basically cried twice a day every day my mom used to tell me if you don't stop crying, i'm going to give you something to cry about. That's how much i was crying between 5 and 13 either because i lost in something because i was so crazy or because somebody picked on somebody in school and that would make me cry because i was so emotionally charged and business selling lemonade, washing cars selling baseball Cards was my place of worth, because i also my report cards right here.

I was an atrocious student and so it's really funny. I very much understand, because that also then became my life, and that became my outland. I guess why i'm interrupting and jumping in is, if you're listening right now, one important thing to tell a lot of parents is being okay with kids. Finding other outlets that aren't your ideology, their outlet may be chess.

It might be youtube, i think, about all the parents that stopped their kids from playing video games when today that kid would be making millions playing video games. Parents are good at looking at the past very bad at looking at the future. When you find passion you have to groom that passion as a coach, which is what a parent does, and so it's an interesting tie-in. Okay, so you get really good as a kid like.

Do you think at 7, 8 12 13, i'm gon na be professional? Does it get that serious for you yeah? It's not even a question for me. It's it's for sure. So, at nine years old i am gon na be a professional tennis. Player 100.

Okay, keep going! Maybe i don't say it, but in my mind there is nothing else. In tennis, like literally saturday and sunday, i spent eight hours each day on the court, and i know i mean after one or two hours. The guy on the other side is tired and then another guy comes, but i i don't leave the court. I stay on the court and i play with maybe four different guys.

So i don't know if i literally said it to myself. I will be a professional, but my life is only about tennis, because my mind is only about ten right monday through fridays, about tennis, saturday and sunday, you're physically playing monday through friday, you're in your head totally same with me. That's why i was bad at school. I couldn't think about school.

I was thinking about what i was gon na sell this weekend. I mean it. I understand it um house, so you i listened carefully so at 16 there was a crossroads where your parents were like no more but at 15 16. You know humbly self-aware could have you gone on the tour in a serious way, yeah.

I think so too. I really think so and that's why it was tough. First of all, because it was my life um and you know i just want to say a few words about what you said, because you said it was extremely true. I would add something.

I think parents also um envision something for their children, which is their vision. Their what they would love to do, what they think is great, and i think that's the major mistakes that they do. They should think. What is what is my son or my daughter, feel, is great for him or her.

What does he love? What is he good at? It's not a question about what you want, because being parents is not what you want. It's helping your children achieve what they're good at and what they're passionate about. It's, probably what you see done poorly by other coaches in your sport. I'm sure without even knowing, but you can already tell.

I know, because i know how life works. There are coaches that are fairly accomplished, but they have a system and that player must come into their system, which is why they can't be consistently great. As a coach. A consistently great coach is in the business of reverse engineering, listening and evolving and filling out the opportunities predicated on the person 100 right.

Thank you. I'm saying that every single day of my life and it changes right, i'm sure serena using her as the icon. She is, i have a very funny feeling that 10 years ago, what she needed for her game from your perspective, based on what she was, was different than it was six years later 100, and what i explained every day is that this is the thing that i Created in my tennis academy, i i didn't want to create a system that the players should fit in. My goal is to create a system that is different for each player, so i start every collaboration with every player with a white page and i learn the player and once i know the player, because i learned the player, then i create a system that is the Best system for him and that system for her him is always evolving 100.

What is true today might not be true tomorrow. In my mind, i am a living and breathing counter puncher to the reality of the day. That's a great way to say it. I'm gon na keep this one.

You got it all right. So now your heart are you heartbroken. Are you mad at your parents or given that era which that was common, it was pain you evolve, and so what did you do? Those next 10 years? I assume you went to university and then what job did you take? So first i was extremely mad at my parents. You have no idea, like literally they destroyed my life.

That's how i felt yeah and it's not that they said you stopped, but they didn't support me. So i know right so in a way, unfortunately, your entrepreneurship part didn't kick in yet you couldn't pay for it totally, yes and so, and the the interesting thing is. I really hated my parents for many years because of what happened and 10 years after and that's when i started martinez academy. I realized that everything that happened was my responsibility and my fault.

I love you for that really. 100. I love you for that and that changed my life when i realized that i actually believe that accountability is the secret potion for happiness. I really believe that i think people hate accountability.

They love to point fingers instead of thumbs. They like to blame bathroom breaks. Instead of themselves, keep going so keep going so so when you decided to lean into accountability, because i'm sure just even getting us knowing about you from afar and now getting a quick sense of you, you're in your head from 16 to 26, about tennis, yeah and So you finally got to that place of adding the ingredient of accountability to the passion which turned the whole thing. 100.

I, what i did you know i started working and actually i worked in my father's company because i didn't know anything about business and he said, come learn a job. At least i said, and what kind of company was it? It was a renewable energy. He he was one of the first ones to do that yeah. Actually, his company became really big.

He was at the stock market. Also in the us, it was the other company in the us one in france he's a great businessman, and he said i mean: do you have siblings? I'm sorry. I have one one brother, who's younger and he's a guitar professional, guitarist, so kind of same story as me. We had something on the side that we were really good at.

So my father said: listen, you don't know what to do because i said i have no idea what to do. My life is. I said: okay, i'm going to learn a job, so i i started to work with not with him actually, but in the company for 10 years and literally at every lunch break, i was going to the tennis. I was eating in front of the courts and i was watching either people were playing like random people or looking at the course and imagining everything that could be achieved on that chord.

I was really doing like like queen's gambit right yeah. Did you see that yeah? You were, you were visualizing exactly exactly and then yes uh, so i learned his job the job and then ten years after my father told me you're ready, we can start to be business partners and i knew my life was easy. Then, if i would say yes - and i told him that i i mean, i thanked him a lot and i said no, i mean thank you, but i'm lucky. I have a passion like most people don't have passion.

I have one and i feel like my pas. I didn't fulfill my passion, so i want to come back to tennis, but i want to the thing i suffered the most from. If i think about it - and i thought about it at that time - was that my parents didn't believe in me tennis wise. They didn't think i would be great, so they said do something else, and i realized how powerful it is to believe in people and how powerful it is for people to have people who believe in them.

So i said to my father: i'm gon na go back to tennis, because i wan na i wan na finish my story. It's not gon na be the same story, but i think i have a story with this sport and what i'm gon na do. I'm gon na help young players achieve their dreams. This is the thing that i was not given the chance to do so.

I will give people the chance to do what i couldn't and what's interesting as i'm thinking this through is then you go into that career and you're met with parents that are actually the reverse of your parents, parents that are delusional a lot of times on how Big, the ups right, if they're coming to that academy, these are parents now that actually all believe that their child, which is amazing but an interest right. You know every parent, i assume going to a real academy if it became the biggest in europe, is literally in belief that their child is going to be number one in the world. They do believe that the child is going to be number one, and i think it's great honestly, it's great, of course you know: when is it all? When does it? When did you know, because everything is i was born in the soviet union? There's a great russian saying that i just said which stands for everything's at its best when it's balanced, you know, i think, a lot about ambition mixed with practicality. When does a parent thinking a kid's number one going to an a cat? You know again, i'm projecting here so jump in they go into the best academy in europe.

They all think at some point. They're way up there and now i'm just gon na take a cliche kid. A kid comes in. They think they're gon na be number one in the world and very quickly.

They meet six other kids that they're not even at this remotely at the same level they're going through that calibration of oh here's four 15 year olds that are way better than me, nine-year-olds. Whatever it is, but their parents are still pushing at the gym when, when is that belief that their kids number one become not a good thing? That's an extremely good question. Uh there is uh. I really love people who support their kids and unfortunately i think it's.

It's the greatest thing that they can do to be the best supporters of the kids, but a lot of those parents live vicariously through their kid right. That's true! That's true, but still it's better than not believing in your kids and respect, much better respect. I'm ten times better uh, that's the best present you can give to people to believe in them. What happens when the kids? What happens when the kid loses passion and the parent? Does it that's where it gets murky? Right, no you're right, but i'm going to steal this.

I still want to answer the first question. Uh, you can be reasonable when you want to be a champion. It's not about reason. Richard williams, from day one said they will both be number one in the world.

The father of coco golf from day one, i know them, i know coco since she's 10., when she was 10, he was believing she's going to be the greatest of all times and he believes a million percent, and this has so much power and brings so much Belief in their son or their daughter, the value of that you have no idea. You know, i understand you know you know. What's funny, i'm sorry interrupt. I i fully know i'm the byproduct of a mother that told me i was gon na be the greatest in the world and i believe it and that's why it works and and when you shoot, you know one of the thing i know where you're going, because I get so upset with parenting that tries to limit their child because you have to go for the moon, because if they end up on the top of a tree, that's better than on the ground, if they end up on the top of a mountain.

That's better! On the ground, but if you don't extend it to the moon, the are we doing and you will never achieve something bigger than what you see. If you see your child being at that level, it will never be better than that level. 100. So i mean, unless that child is lucky enough to have an emotional stronghold within themselves and start to value other people's opinions, besides their parent, which is why rocket, which is why music has always been powerful right.

It's why fame is interesting. Fame used properly can be one of the great superpowers in the world because it gives somebody that a child admires the leverage of that child to dream bigger than the parents are dreaming for them totally, but we always come back to people believing in other people, man. It's always the same thing so tell so now you start the academy. Is it an instant hit because you have this 10 years of learning? You probably have some of your dad's natural business dna.

You have the passion or was it a struggle upfront? How did it go from the beginning? The start was tough yeah. I was just renting two courts in a club right at a time when it was not expensive and and right so bad time slots to keep the cost down. Yes, it's the greatest time arbitrage. I love it keep going when you look back it's the best moment, because you have to figure out how to make it starting from scratch and after two years i realized that i had no chance, because i was nobody in tennis.

No credibility, never coached anyone. So i didn't have a lot of things for myself except an incredible motivation. I have no idea an incredible ambition because i went at that time to all the agents which i didn't. Who i didn't know and i said: listen, i'm gon na be the best.

I'm gon na build the biggest academy in europe. You have to help me now and they all told me do it and we'll help you i'll say no, but i'll do it. Did you not find one? My i think the greatest part of my career is being that one person, because i think, if you're right, one out of ten times for everybody who's in a luxurious position in their business life or emotionally, as a human being right once out of 10 times to The patricks that come to you will offset the other nine losses. You didn't fight, you didn't find one person no and actually it's very european.

Probably i have a very anti-entrepreneurship. You know point of view like i, i i'm from europe i'm born in eastern europe, but it's it baffles me. The lack of like the the culture and europe is so fragmented. This is such a broad statement and there's tons of amazing entrepreneurs, but, like man, i wish there was more entrepreneurship across europe.

It would help europe a lot. I agree keep going right, yeah um, so i thought i need a name. I need a name because i need credibility if i want to convince no, i needed for my academy, like a coach, because if i have a coach's name, that is really famous, of course the kids will want. So what happened? I happened to meet uh the greatest coach in tennis.

At that time his name was bob rhett. He was australian, as he was unfortunately died. Last year and um. I found a way to have one hour meeting with him and i convinced him - and i want to say just one word about that when at 16 my parents decided not to follow me in my dreams, and i said i took accountability for that.

I understood that i should have convinced them, and this is what i failed. Nobody else did that's right and i did fail because i i was not, i haven't been able at that time to listen to them and if i had understood what they were scared of. I, for example, i would just convince them correct from that time i decided from now i'm going to convince people right because the same way you coach people and watch them. It's just reverse engineering.

If you listen yeah totally 100, so you use that skill set. You understood at this point. Obviously look: you were 16., it's hard. You know to be fully baked at 16.

now at 28 or 29 you're you've got it and you're able to convince the best coach in the world to use your academy to train there to kind of his name. Give me his name and he mentored me, but it was not in the deal, but we had a great relationship, so he helped me and it became babrita academy for the first six years. So we did six years together and one day he left, he said i'm gon na do my own tennis academy, fair enough, but then i thought wow that was the worst investment in my life. I invested six years on a brand on a name and this brand, because now it's now he's my competitor, that's right! So it's terrible! That's why i put my name, so i decided okay.

When i never make that mistake again, i mean i get it. That's important in life yeah, if you, if you keep doing the same mistakes, call me once 100 so and what happens because in those six years i'm sure at the moment it was the worst feeling. But in hindsight now that's what's good about a couple. More gray, hairs right, you realize so much good happened in those six years.

That gave you the leverage for what you're about to say happen. Next, yes, you're right and i wanted to give up honestly, i was so disappointed, like you felt, like you felt let down. Yes, on a personal yeah makes sense by the way. This is an important point.

Everybody that's listening. If you, you know the gentleman that left and uh god rest his soul, you know when you're that person with the name. Sometimes you go through the same feelings. You know you're renting your name and you had the leverage, and you know in partnerships, especially the one you described very tricky.

People are coming from very opposite tension points, and you know there was probably a point where he had resentment from his perspective or he saw a missed opportunity, and so i have a lot of compassion for both of you in that scenario um. But a lot of people do give up and become cynical and angry at this crossroads and do actually spend most of their energy tearing down looking backwards again kudos to you, i'm sure, because of that chip on your shoulder from 16 gave you the energy to give It another swing and a new version you're right and i was very disappointed on a personal level, but if i look back it's the best thing that ever happened. Yes, the two things: the fact that he trusted me was unbelievable. I was nobody.

I was a kid. I was 28, i didn't know anything this guy he gave trusted me. He gave me my chance and and like he took me under his wings and by the way him leaving is the best thing to happen to you, because that's why you're sitting here right now? 100. 000.

So what happened? What's your next big break? So now you got to build up your own brand yeah. What happens because i assume some kids came through in those six years. Something must have happened right yeah. I i decided to speak to all my teams.

So i had everyone around, i said guys, so i'm going to put my name because i don't want the same thing to happen again, but i'm not a tennis coach. So now i have to become a tennis coach. I was like 33 years old. I never get the guys told me, but you never give a tennis lesson in your life.

What are you talking about like they were all professional coaches and i said to them: well guys you're right, but i learned fast. So i'm going to start now and i gave myself 10 years to win a grand slam as a coach, which is i mean, 99.9 percent of the coaches will never win a grand slam as a as coaches in their life, and it took me 10 years to Win and we i won 10 with serena, so yeah. So this my plan worked and it worked, and i always say that for two reasons, first of all, you couldn't find someone more motivated than me. I think it was impossible.

I was literally thinking coaching day and night waking up at night with ideas, writing them down, and the thing that was an asset at that time is that i didn't know anything. A hundred blind eyes are dangerous. That's what i was saying. Yeah blind eyes are dangerous.

My entire career, every industry, i've gone into, i knew nothing about and i'm always dominant, because all i do is try to figure out what's value, not how people did it. I had exactly the same strategy i thought. Well, i don't have the tactical tools, the technical tools, i didn't learn anything, but i have to figure out how to make this player win, which which led to why it worked, because the technical tools are a commodity. The mental tools are not the seeing.

The gray is not the commodity, anybody can teach you a proper forehand or a backhand over time can be taught. You can watch videos, the grey of being number one in the world is the actual punchline yeah, and i was all about how to win. How does my player win points? How does she lose his points uh, and how can i help her who's? Your first significant player in that 10-year run, who let's say, had got to the quarters or who was your first significant player, marcos baghdadis? Oh yes, so he reached the final of the open. Remember i started with him.

He was 13 and a half years old um. He was at my tennis academy and when then he got when he got older and started to play on tour. He asked me to coach him, so that was a big moment. Oh yeah huge huge, and what was that? What was the if i asked you privately and now it's going to be publicly.

What's the thing you're most proud of that you helped marcos with whether it was by the way whether it's following the narrative we've been talking about and something about mind or maybe, if it's just actually something technical. If i asked you the thing that you're most proud of, or you feel good about, it feels nice inside of you something subtle or specific, that you helped him with thoughts. You know you have to understand how people work i mean work, how they process, how they process. Yes, what makes them have the will? The motivation you know and put everything on the table, yeah and marcos was all about emotions all about it about all about love.

If he would feel love from you and for you, he would die on the court, and i think i made him feel that that's awesome, it's really cool what happens next? What's the next significant player uh i worked with, i mean they were not super famous. That's okay, but they were good players and they become better with me every time and that's what i'm always doing and that's where you were getting confidence right, as this was happening. You're like to your point right: yes, if you were one if they were 113 in the world, they come to you and they're 89. That means something 100 and i always say we are all the result of all our experiences.

That's right: when you create positive experiences, you build the feeling that you are good at what you're doing you become, and you become better affirmation: affirmation, affirmation, yes, and especially when you keep that mindset that i had from day, one which is my strength, which is i'm Good because i always start thinking, i know nothing and i kept that humility is foundational, because some coaches have a result, very good results with one player and they think. Oh now, i know correct, and this is when they're done it's finished and then they repeat the same recipe all their life. That's not coaching! That's right! Coaching is a different recipe. Every time you have to discover how to make a great bolognese pasta like if it's the first time, you're gon na, do it.

If i asked you a coaching regret, or in hindsight you could have done something a little bit better with a player because you didn't see it, but that player taught you and you didn't make the same mistake in the future. Does anything stand out like i'm? Not about regress, i never had regrets. Yes, i don't regret anything in my life and i did mistakes like everybody yeah. The only thing i can regret because, but just because of one reason because it destroyed my relationship with him is what happened with marcos.

At the end, uh because i was not on, i was not listening to him anymore and understanding him anymore, and i was he was doing so well. I wanted him to keep going and uh. I was not able to listen anymore and i was more like acting like a bad father like i own him he's like my son, so he can't he can't go a different direction from the one i want - and this is a th was not coaching anymore and I was not in a coaching relationship with him anymore. It became deeper emotional, exactly and i read, which is why you're empathetic to your father about what he did with you totally, and i reacted too much emotionally rather than as a coach, and he didn't understand me at that time and and our relationship became bad and Uh and this this was this was really bad, and if i look at that, i was a terrible coach at the end of the relationship with marcos, and this was the biggest lesson for me.

I never did that again. Never ever i always found a way to take emotion away and when i felt every time i felt emotional in my job as a coach, i was always shutting up taking time away yep and coming back only when i was ready, because the emotion was thank you For sharing that, that's that's going to help a lot of people. Thank you. So i have an interesting question just for fun.

This is just my tennis nerdum this. By the way, i'm sorry to everybody, i'm just going completely. I've been doing pretty well in a linear line, but i'm just going completely random now, because i'm too excited to ask this. I've been waiting the whole time to ask this question actually observing from afar and being very in the sport which player as you've been very deep over the last 10 15 20 years.

Whatever it's been, do you believe, was most side railed by injuries and had she or he not been hurt, they would have been a number one player or an iconic player. Just complete tennis, fun chat i'll. Give you a second because it's a fun question. Okay, so someone who has been so injured, he would have been number one over the last 50 yeah over the last 10 15 years, 20 years.

You've been so deep in this, whether it was early on, like you have such a great eye that you're a professional, you know what the you're talking about. Not me like a fan ju. If i said to you that question somebody who's come along in the last 20 years that you're disappointed, because you would have loved to see them play her him at their highest level. But unfortunately it was injuries that kind of derailed them less so mindset, because i think a lot of those people come along too, but injuries i'm just genuinely curious.

No, i there is one i think of. Unfortunately, i don't remember his name and he's american and he was unbelievable, he's the same generation as marty fish. Of course, i don't remember his name because he didn't do so well, but so he came up with fish blake those guys right, yes, and he was well somebody who's listening right now give your guests on twitter yeah describe them a little bit, because that will probably Help some of the hardcore fans remember incredibly talented, playing very flat very loose great. I mean he had everything this guy and he had like injuries all his career and he never made it to very high.

I think it was top 100. It was top 100. I think maybe once but not for long, and it would have been top 10 for sure in your subjective opinion, eisner eyes, or you know like all these guys he was on a different planet. I mean we're talking about guys who were top ten yeah, so he was for me at least able to be top 10 uh, if not more wow and uh.

I i know a lot of people think the same by the way. You just can't recall his name right now, yes, and - and there is another one i'm thinking of, but she's still playing it's uh andresku. I think andre school has a huge game, mentally she's, so strong, so strong, but so young and still i mean already struggling with a lot of injuries, and i think that for her, the question about having a great career or not is only about managing her body. To stay away from injuries, it is going to be the fight of her all her career, who was your favorite player growing up? So strangely, because i was playing servant volley and richard volley, i was always at the net.

My favorite player was bjorn borg, of course, and then patrafter late later. For me, the player i've loved the most watching i loved stefan edberg like loved. Really, yes, i i don't even know why. What did you love about him? He seemed small.

He seemed kind of like he. You know what i loved about him. It was just timing. I l, i grew up.

You know i loved mcenroe as a kid east coast, i'm a hot head. I did all the stupid things on the court like back in row at five at 7. 8. 9.

10. 11. 12. When i played a lot but then lendl came along and kind of took that from mcenroe and i hated lendl right i was i was.

You know my parents left the soviet bloc, so you and he was very mean looking and i was scared of lendl and and edberg kind of like you know. I liked matt spinlander a little bit. You know, but like edberg kind of had that little period in that edberg owned that little window for two or three years in between the lendel era, and then, when the whole, you know sampras and agassi thing started. I liked i liked his net game.

You know because i also played that. Well, i was small and i wasn't strong, so i was incredibly intuitive, so i played at the net a ton. It's also why i already brought up michael chang right smaller. You know it.

It fit me and it was the height of when i was watching yeah. I i liked also stephen berg and the great guy also uh. I think it was too clean for me. I love the the rafter style like was so physical at the jumping, very animal.

That's what i loved with him. He was an animal at the net. You know it's funny the reason i love novak, the most and right from the beginning. There's there's a moment that novak does often, and i'm always wondering if people understand what he's doing, because it is how i live my life.

My chip is less around my parents and it's more against the world. I love being an underdog. I might even right now, as i'm telling you this story, my chemic, my competitive chemicals are moving. I can feel it.

I believe that novak had it better than anybody ever because the world loves rafa and federer, and so my favorite moment in tennis ever is a recent phenomenon, which is when novak plays wimbledon and is andy, and i love you so much and the whole world is Against him that their classic match four years ago or one or three years ago i was at a bar eating with the kids and the whole place is rooting raj. And there was a big point in that fifth set like a stunning point that novak won and i got so stumped loud yeah and and and everybody looked at me and a guy came over to me and said you're not really rooting for him. I go with all my heart, but what novak does - and i love this so much - there's no business version of it, so i can never really do it. Only when i buy the jets and win a lombardi trophy will i be able to feel this where he wins the match or a point, and he just looks at the entire crowd and just says you now what i love it that look.

He does it's everything to me, and so it's funny that you say too clean, because it's funny i by far my favorite players have been more dirty, but the height of me watching all the tournaments. You know on espn watching cincinnati like the height of my like consumption, because then i started working at 14 and had no time to watch. Tv um was ed berg, but but what novak represents right now speaks to me, the most because nobody's rooting for him. Nobody - and there is another reason why he is whis.

You are totally right in what you're saying for sure he uses the he uses the fact that he's an underdog and he's using the fact that people are against me for in his favor to to become better to uh, to to find more more great. But the second thing that he has is the belief, because if you go back in time, maybe 15 years ago, rafa and roger were winning absolutely everything correct and i know all i knew all the top tens at that time already and i was speaking to them And all of them were telling me it's impossible to win a grand slam, because those two guys there's they're in a different level, different planet - and i remember a young guy 19 coming up and playing finally roger in a grand slam first round. So he was not nobody yet and he's interviewed the day before and in the press. He says: i'm gon na beat him and i remember the press saying who the is this guy? Who does he think he is still cocky? And i remember him saying i'm not cookie, i believe in myself and this guy, who was, as you understood, novak, ended up.

Beating the two greatest of all times became number one and will pro pro probably end up being the greatest of all times, because he believed in himself more than anyone, even at a time when it was almost impossible to believe in oneself beating the two guys. So that's the power of belief and of course it comes also from your education from the fact that i'm coming back to that people believe in you so much uh. But it's also something that you build throughout your experiences and you reach a point where the belief is so strong that nothing cannothing can destroy it and it's it's the biggest gas you can put in your car what happens to a player? That's number one for a while when she or he what what is typical in your opinion of when they lose the belief. So what's amazing about my life, because i'm i think through sports 24 7, but in business, it's not a winner.

Take all game! You know it's not like i'm playing like i'm winning and many people that i look at that i know are like me: they're winning and i'm happy for them, because the world of business everyone can win really, even if you're competing against somebody in business there's. So much market in tennis there's a tournament, so only one person wins. I will never lose the belief we're talking about ever ever ever, i'm blindly religious that i'm going to be the greatest businessman of all time and then there's really no affirmation one way or the other along the way that i go. But i wonder with a john mcenroe because he has to be believing or connors or a becker or an agassi or a sampras or like what have you seen or what tends to happen.

Or can you notice, when you can see the switch of for three and a half years? They believe that and something's happening, whether it's an outside force or an inside force that clicks it. The other way very, very interesting question. First of all, all most of the very, very, very good young players go climb the rankings very fast, so they're in a success, cocoon cocoon exactly and at some point when you reach the typically really top. Sometimes you hit the wall one time two times three times.

You know you play okay, you play a grand slam, semi, you lost, you lose to novak and then you lose to rafa and then you lose to roger and after a certain time you stop to believe - and i can see it from outside, because i see that Suddenly there are some things: if you really pay attention you can see it, that's why, for example, they would they would take a coach that is not too expensive. Certainly, oh interesting, because you don't invest anymore in your career. Okay, you send me a very good message. It's quite clear, but then even going to the talking about the best you know talking about serena, for example.

Who is probably the great i mean she is the greatest of all times? No, no! No, no, not probably both sides, uh she's, just 23 grand slams and i started working with hershey at 13., which is already incredible insane insane when i start working with him she's at a period of time, when she's doubting because two years without winning a grand slam, Uh it's long for someone like her. Yes, it's long and she's number seven in the world and you know yeah she's, she's doubting. You know anyone can doubt, of course, even the greatest and when i start with her, i have a very clear image of of her, because i look very closely even from afar, because i i was not coaching her before and i have a clear idea of how She processes and how she thinks and when i started working together, we started working together. The first tournament we she plays is wimbledon and she reaches the semifinals and when she's in the semis.

I will remember that all my life, i'm at the restaurant in wimbledon and she runs to me with a big smile and she says, guess what whatever happens at the end of the tournament. I'm gon na be top three in the world and i can't believe she's saying something like that interesting. I can't believe it. So i asked, though i answer and what she says he's great.

No, i said what are you talking about? Being three in the world is great: you're. Thirteen yeah are you joking? I can't believe it so she doesn't answer and in the evening she sends me a text message and she said sorry for what i said today. That was ridiculous. Number three is terrible and number two, also even worse, even worse and the the lesson i learned at that moment is even the greatest of all times who process i mean you have no idea how they think, because for her number two is the worst thing on The planet, even them when that comes, you can start to think 100.

Life is long. You go through journeys. I love that and what happened in that wimbledon. She won it and then she did singles and doubles three weeks after she won olympic gold medals in singles.

In doubles, one month after she won the us open and at the end of the year she won the masters and then two months after she was number one and she stayed three and a half years in a row number one in the world love it love It what have we not touched on as we wrap up here, anything that you want people to have. We can talk uts, but it's gon na be too long. I think so. I i want you to ask him um, since we don't edit, that was maha in the background always fun to have you always fun to have you uh on the podcast um yeah? Where do you think tennis is going well? If i look at the the demographics, they don't look good uh.

A lot of studies have been made on tennis, uh and on golf and other sports by the tv channels, and they found out that the average age of the the fan of tennis, who is following tennis and watching tennis on a regular basis, is 61 years old. Which is very old, 64 for golf, but it's very old and and it's getting older every year and i'm i mean i'm i'm upset with that's uh and i'm i'm all worrying. Also. You know for our sport and i start to try to understand why and if i look at the situation i, what i understand is that the tennis format is a very old format.

It's more than a year a century ago. Yes, it was created and the the way people consume, that type of content has completely changed in the last 10, 15 years with the digital. So what people are watching it to today? It's contents which are short, dynamic, immersive and authentic, mma esports. Exactly so, tennis is long, sometimes very long.

Yesterday, five hours, yes slow the time when the ball is in play is less than 15 percent of the time. That's right not immersive at all and not authentic, because they all pretend they're the nicest people on the planet - and you know this, which is now you're, really going into. Why i love novak versus the field. Exactly oh rodol, it's harwood you listening to that.

Little subtle moment keep going my friend, so i thought. Oh, we have to do something because the atp, the wt, the grand slams, are not going to change tennis and i don't think we should change. Tennis. Tennis is beautiful.

The way it is yes, we have a billion fans. Yes, yes, they're getting older, because our fan base is the fan base that we fell in love with tennis in the 70s and the 80s and we're not renewing our fan base and we're not reaching out to the young generation. And if you think about it, it even gets scarier because if you think about raj rafa, novak serena you're talking about global icons, they're not unknown they're they're, pretty famous in the scheme of things to a 20 and 30 and 40 year old. So you've got a golden era of celebrity, and yet you still have this problem.

It's not like you know. As you know, there's been pockets sometimes when we have stars transitioning, where some people sneak in a couple of cheap grand slams that aren't all time. This is not one of them, and so for that to be the case, it becomes double concerning it is and uh so we're not renewing at our fan base and we're not reaching out to the young generation. So, as tennis has to stay the way it is, i decided to create a second league which would be in a way complementary to the mainly to the to the league that we all know atp wta grand slams, a second league with the goal to reach out To the new generations, so in parallel in our pockets that don't disrupt the core schedules, exactly like you know my favorite football league, i'm an american football fan to the nine there was a league in the 80s called the usfl and i loved it.

Why? Because it played in the spring it didn't disrupt the nfl um. Unfortunately, the ownership there decided they had to go against the nfl, they sued the nfl and it failed. But it's too bad because the league had momentum. They had real players, reggie white, steve, young iconic players, jim kelly, and it could have been a great league and then i would have gotten more football um and i've always thought that the biggest mistake of when somebody tries to disrupt the establishment is they don't play? The pockets of reverse engineering, the white space - and it's funny to hear you say this - i didn't know this you're, basically doing a league version of what you do for an athlete you're playing around the reality.

Instead of trying to create the conflict exactly yeah and i think there is a space for everyone and i think it's great for tennis, and when did you start? I started last year right after the confinement in france all right and then i hope it and it's a little challenging exactly and i said i'm gon na do it and i want to do the proof of concept yeah. So i imagined i told the team. Listen guys imagine we create tennis today, knowing what we know about how people consume that kind of right content. How would you do it so we create something: a match is 45 minutes much less time between the the points, coaching at every point, uh coaching at every point, every point they have cards, they have cards, they can use cards to have extra like.

I want one extra serve at 45 minute, oh interesting, at 45 minutes it's over and whoever's winning wins. Yes, but it's four quarters of eight minutes. Every quarter is eight minutes. There is at every changeover.

There is an interview. It can be a celebrity, oh so you're really going. I like it very uts, which means ultimate tennis showdown. I love it, and so we did it.

I had most of the top players who played like zverev sitsi pass beretini medvedev. I mean most of them real players. We were broadcasted since day, one in more than a hundred countries in the world. We streaming streaming very nice.

Also on our ttv platform, we reach, we have more than a 1.3 million fans already on facebook. After just four events, we have more than 120 000 people who are subscribers on our ott platform. So i mean for me the proof of concept is made so now we're uh into a capital race to go full good for you and to do a real season. Only with 10 events, because i don't want to disrupt the http and the wta 10 events - 10.

Big events - and this is my thing - 10 players only ten events, ten cities. Why ten players? Because i found out that ninety percent? Does that mean somebody has a buy? No, i play with only ten players formula, one twenty twenty nine drivers. Why? Because i found out that 90 of the fans do not know 90 of the players you're being very nice. You know that right 98 of the fans - don't i mean really, because i'm really, because i i've been i've - thought as an entrepreneur three four years ago.

The reason i can answer that is because i was like maybe i'm going to disrupt tenant like it's so real. I think the opportunity is very real. I love that listen we've got to go patrick! Thank you. So so so much uh everybody, please uh! Please uh! Do you have uh social handles where people can follow? You of course spell it out.

My instagram, yes, uh p. Maretoglu at the pinwheel, you want to spell that, because there's a lot of yeah, what the is that p-m-o-u-r-a-t-o-g-l-o-u, i love it. Thank you, my friend, thank you very much for the invitation youtube watcher. What's up, it's garyvee! First of all, thank you so much.

I hope. You're doing super well during these times. I also want to ask you please subscribe, because my commitment and exploration of youtube is about to explode stories, polls, more content, more engagement, more surprise and delight. This is the time to subscribe.

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