Money is oxygen for business. I'm a pretty altruistic fofy foofy. Let's all love each other guy. But if I can't make pay roll, all my good ideas aren't going to matter anyway.

Attention is the number one asset. It is a pleasure to have you here at Muss Show today all the way from. New York City That's right, and you managed to fit Us in. which is great.

Now on the podcast. Um, we always kick things off with a Juicy Business confession. Okay, yes, how our guest have turned a previous adversity or mistake into action or a positive sort of drive for growth in their own business. So Gary yes, what is your business Confession: Um, you know I think for people that are entrepreneurs and really actually I think about this in the context of life I Think that we have it a little bit misunderstood.

I Think in general, the joury journey of the game of Business and Entrepreneurship is a constant flow of micro losing with the occasional macro win if it goes great, you know. So for me, confessions I mean there's been so many mistakes. I I As a matter of fact, the book that the audience has it's called 12 and a half. It's because in the book I Talk about the fact that Cander as a leader has been very hard for me.

which is always shocking for people who follow me on social media because as Gary Ve Cander is actually my ultimate strength I Get to it in this interview. Cander will be my strength. But in real life when I'm an executive and really as a human being, the more I know you and care about you, the harder it was for me to tell you the things that I was struggling with that you were doing. and so I think about all the sloppy firings in my 20s and 30s in my family wine business and even in Vayner media early on that could have done been done so much more gracefully.

Could have been so much more clear. I used to let people sit around the company for 3 6, 12 24 months longer than they should have really really. and so I thought I was being a good guy right I was saying like oh well I'm paying them and they stink. Um, and in reality even 18 months later when finally in a roundabout way they would get fired, they would be double angry And it was cuz I wasn't able to give feedback along the way I wasn't able to be canderous.

So it's a huge huge vulnerability that I'm so glad I'm making progress on. So you've changed that Now if someone's not doing something you you talked about this earlier. do you give them scope to improve or you just say this is not working Bang my you know there's a lot to this this could maybe I should lay down on this couch. My father who I worked for from 14 to 34 was very good at Cander.

The problem was it was delivered with Venom right and I wasn't able to discern the delivery mechanism from the value of the cander. So I demonized cander because I viewed it as fear and I think all of us here know that many times when people have been given critical feedback, that person ran back and went to their LinkedIn and started looking for another job because we didn't land. C The reason I call it kind cander is I think you know I have a lot of respect for the concept of radical cander. I have a lot of concept respect for cander.

but I think what is required is kind cander. And now that now don't mistake the word kind for delusional and entitlement kind cander. So it's a very fine line to tell someone you are falling short subjectively in my opinion. A Lot of times When Leaders leave feedback to people and giving them feedback, they act as if it's absolute truth.

It's absolute truth from their subjective opinion. but they happen to be in a position where they have to make that subjective call. So finding that balance has been quite challenging. But I've made a million business mistakes I Passed on Uber twice in the angel round.

If I wrote the normal 25 to $50,000 check that I was writing back then as an investor, I would have made $500 million. Yeah, that's a big mistake. That's a big mistake. That one hurts.

but you've owned it and and you move on or you, you still talk about it of course I talk about it because you know people when people are like well, you invested in Facebook and Twitter and Tumblr and like it can look real good. but like yes and I did really well. But I thought yo Bango was going to be the biggest app I ever invested in. Now to my credit, Yoongo was two years earlier than Tinder and Tinder was a very big success.

So when I saw yob Bango I'm like wait, you can know the people around you I'm like yeah, people are going to hook up you know, like and and I I I got it. But what? I learned by passing on Uber and I invested in Uber a little bit after that, but by the time the valuation changed, it changed my outcome dramatically. Still, very early. my brother AJ took the first Uber in Manhattan So it was early, but it wasn't early enough for this gamechanging thing.

But in that window of investing in Yoongo because I loved the idea and not investing in Uber early enough because I underestimated what the power of a good operator meant I learned a lot which is today I invest first based on what I think about the person second, about what I think about the idea and that is is that how you find those businesses? That's what you look for first. Yes, because in that person that you're looking for with my subjective intuitive feel, if they have the stomach for the game, entrepreneurship is uncomfortably lonely. For all the people that are sitting here that live in corporate jobs and and put entrepreneurs or fantasize about doing their own thing, you know people like: Gary I want to leave my job and be my own boss I'm like being an entrepreneur and CEO means everyone's your boss I work for everyone that's sitting in that front row and I really like feel that like actually no Am I allowed to curse? No Oh what's great about entrepreneurship is you make your own rules so you know I think I think you know the Grass Is Always Greener Entrepreneurship is my great passion I Spoke about it rapidly amassing my audience and then I had to take a step back 5 to seven years ago and say wait a minute I Grew up when entrepreneurship was demonized and not even cool. everybody had to go to UNI and get great grades.

Now we've flipped too far in the other direction. I Better start talking about entrepreneurship is not for everyone cuz it's not the amount of people that go into entrepreneurship because it's cool and then find themselves incredibly depressed because the thing about entrepreneurship is it's like sports you can't hide when you fail. When you get fired at a job, it's your boss's fault, right? But when you start a company and it goes out of business, there's nowhere to hide. And the world has fallen in love with blaming everyone.

Governments, parents, companies, systems, social networks. The world has become remarkably good at blaming everyone we do not like. accountability. Entrepreneurship is the ultimate accountability.

I Say to my company all the time because it's true. 100% of what's wrong at Vayner Media is 100% my fault because it's true because if you're mad at somebody over here or over here, well, I hired that person or I hired the person that hired that person. and I have the ability to do something about it. Nobody in my company of the 2,000 employees globally, has 100% autonomy to do anything about it about anything other than me.

So when you start to understand, understand what that game is. that is not for everyone. So you're in the game and it sounds like you're pretty comfortable with being uncomfortable. So why do you think it's important for entrepreneurs to embrace discomfort to succeed? Cuz there's no option? That was it.

But I mean it right for the the pause for effect is cuz there's no option. The only only thing when uh, how many people in the audience I know this is a podcast and are listening. This is I'm doing this selfishly. Are parents raise your hands? When you become a parent, something changes.

You realize you're the last line of defense for this human And it changes. It triggers something in you. Your life changes. You don't sleep the same way.

There's something else that you massively have to worry about in addition to your own safety. Well, that's the truth of Entrepreneurship like especially when you go Global I have a global company I What people like? How do you wake? You know like everyone's pushing us for healthier behavior and I have a lot of great healthy behaviors I sleep a ton which is always confusing to people. They think I'm one of these like I don't I sleep six seven eight hours cuz I need it cuz I'm on when I'm awake I do I eat very clean I do a lot of good things. One thing I don't do that is considered a good thing to do is the second I wake up I grab my phone so fast you couldn't even imagine.

not because I want to because it's my responsibility I have to look if anything happened in Singapore or in s like it. just it's my responsibility I'm always on. I we just got out of the holidays. it's my favorite time when the whole world is off because it's the only time that I can vacation I can't take a normal vacation I have too much responsibility because even if I did take a week off next week I can't be calm.

There's too much going on and I'm going to come back to it. It's not like when I took like when you work somewhere you leave like you can actually get away from that week some way somehow. not when you own something. so it's an intense game.

Uh, but but why should they get comfortable? It's because they have no options. Yeah, now you touched on Gary the essence of you a little bit. Now you saw baseball cards as a child in New Jersey You grew your father's wine business. You told us that and and you built up your advertising agency V Media.

So you're a total entrepreneur through and through. But what is the thread through all your experiences that have given us? Gary V I have a tremendous relationship with losing I Believe that the reason I'm successful in life forget about my business accomplishments the way I deem my success in my life is I lack anxiety compared to the majority of humans on Earth I'm happy is completely and utterly in association to my relationship with losing because I was born in the Soviet Union and immigrated to the US and grew up with very little because I grew up in the 80s in America where you went outside and you played and which means you played games and you lost a lot because I grew up outside in the 80s in New Jersey I also got into fights because that's that's what we used to do. You would fight because I got bad grades by the time I was 18 years old I had done so much losing that I wasn't scared of it. Modern society so over coddles everyone.

Do you know that we give away eighth place trophies? Now we have de the When PE today's work, today's world where everyone's like why is everyone so anx it's co it's social media No it's not. It's modern parenting. The reason everyone's all bent at of shape is in what was good intent to making it good for our children. We created zoo animals who then have to go into the wild and get eaten by a lion in one minute.

We've we've overcorrected when you go to therapy when you learn about life when something's going on over here, humans tend to think the way to balance it is to go over here. That's how we've gotten to where we are. But the answer is to go here. The reason you got Gary V is cuz my mother is a gangster.

She parented me perfectly. She put things like me being kind to people on a pedestal not getting straight. A's when I got out of line, there was consequences. Remember some of the older people in the audience when you did something wrong, you would either get smacked or if you got lucky, you got grounded for a week without video games, television, and friends.

Today there's not even grounding. So what? Back to entrepreneurship? Back to being resilient, Back to being capable. You have to deal with adversity. I Dealt with So much that what? After dealing with all that crap, all that.

having every grown-up in my childhood besides my mother tell me I was going to be a loser cuz I got D's and Fs between getting into fights and growing up in tough neighborhoods and going through all that you think some random person on social media saying that I'm an idiot is going to bother me? Is it about shutting out the noise? Obviously, but it's shutting out the noise both ways. On the flip side, all those lovely things you said about me yeah I don't hear that either, don't you? I sure don't. The reason reason that I'm capable of dealing with negativity is because I don't overvalue positivity either. Yeah, if you get high on the accolades and the cheering, you become vulnerable to the booing.

So I'm aware that I'm good at business. so are lots of other people and everyone I'm looking at and everyone that's listening is also good and great at other things too. So I'm appreciative. I'm humbled.

It feels remarkable to be living the life I'm living. but I Do not think I am better than so. Do you think that's a downfall of lots of successful people? Yes, money and fame and success don't change people. They expose them and many people get to money.

Fame And success fueled by insecurity. A smaller group The Fortunate ones get there through gratitude and that is how the game is played. It's beautiful. Now you're CEO in the Fck business.

Um, but what would you say is the one thing that CEOs should be doing I Believe the majority of CEOs of let's call it Fortune 50,000 so not just 500, not even just 5,000 But let's go smaller. B I would say the 50,000 largest businesses in the world This the number one thing that I can tie that. I observe and I watch a lot on this that the CEO should be doing more of is spending more one-on-one time with employees in their organization. So are you saying that you should be doing that well? I Would tell you that if you looked at my diary right now, you would be flabbergasted by how much one-on-one time I have with my employees I would argue that I spend more time on HR actually I'm so I was about to say I spend more time on HR than most things I do as Co I'm going to take it to the extreme I probably if you looked at my calendar Diary of last year prob if I broke down the time I spent on finance with the CFO and the time I spent uh with people in one-on-one and with my pet team with this the people team that's our HR department I would say the breakdown of those two ratios and I'm going to try to undersell it to not hyperbolize.

It was 87% to 133% but that's one of the things obviously working with the company and I work with your team. That's what they say that you are very good at that time. You make people feel I I just don't really I struggle with understanding almost what else a CEO should be doing. of course I know I need to set the vision of course I know I need to business develop I I Understand But man, every organization you know how they say You're only as happy as your most unhappy child I Think about that at Vayner Media I believe that we are only as strong as the person that's least happy there and I address it constantly.

Batter it, batter it I Spent this week in London and like we just I mean it was like I said something off the cuff CU I addressed the whole company globally out of London this week to kick off the year and I said this is a family business not a corporation and the more that you believe me and the more that we act like that, the more we will win. and I think you know for a lot of people in this audience, they don't know enough to know how real this is to me for you because you interact with my team, you can believe what I'm saying more but that front row they know I'm telling the truth right? and so that's how I live my life I Want to be I want to be liked more by the people that really know me versus the people that know of me. Okay, yeah and I appreciate that. and I I think about that a lot because I think the world's confused I think there's a lot of popular people in the world that are incredibly disliked by the people around them.

Yeah, it's so true, right that that was a weird thing that happened to me when I got into The High Ground of society and interacted with like really fancy people. I was devastated by that. People that are perceived in public as like awesome are like poisonous to their people. Then how do those people keep being successful? Fear Humans Weaponize.

Fear. Fear is incredibly powerful. It stops almost everybody that's listening to this right now from doing the thing they want. So a lot of people that work for these famous people or people EV Accolades don't think people will believe them.

They're scared. they're scared that if they leave, that power person is so powerful it will screw them up. Fear Fear is the single worst thing in the world and it is weaponized constantly by businesses, by politicians, by governments, and worst of all by parents. So I just want to go back to the CEO thing.

What should CEO stop doing? That's a good question I mean look the first one was so easy cuz it was so I feel it's so uncomfortably Universal The second one is why I Love having Vayner media. We get to work with so many businesses and the truth is, there's a different answer for a lot of things you know public CEOs Need to stop worrying about just their pockets if you really are educated about public companies and you're really into this: I Can almost predict what most companies are going to do based on my intuition of how much longer that CEO plans on being in their role. If I believe a CEO is looking to retire in two years, I know the next two years the stock price is going to go way up. CU They're going to cut costs at all costs because they have two years to get it up as high as they can and then they have another six months that they have to wait and then they're going to sell all their shares to buy their boat and their Island and their Jet and their life.

And that usually means that's in direct contrast to actually growing the business because you're cutting cost, not investing in growth, right? So that's a public CEO and I think some of them should care more about the Legacy If they spent those last two years building the crap out of the business, they might be able to hold on to the stock longer than the six months and actually get double of the money by setting up the next CEO to let them keep going. But I get how human behavior works. I Understand they've worked hard, they want to enjoy their last 15 years. it all.

Really nothing that happens in the world doesn't make sense to me. but I would say that's one thing. I I Think the other thing they should do is stop underestimating their competitors. Think there's a lot of delusion, meaning they shouldn't fixate on their competitors.

But we live in a world where the speed and change is so high that even if you think you've got a moat an advantage, it is vulnerable at all times because the speed of innovation is unparalleled. so just a little less naive like were this, that's nice. but IBM was that and then Microsoft came along and then Microsoft was that and then Google came along and then Google was that and then Facebook came along like the biggest companies in the world always go out of business or decline. But then I Guess you know we talked about money making money.

If if that's the objective and and where some people I think value it or will Define your success on money is will that always drive businesses and drive you know what CEOs do and and their main objective you know I Look I think money is a very fascinating thing and as a human being, I'm so grateful that I got lucky and parented well and circumstances didn't allow me to put that thing on a pedestal. On the flip side, money is oxygen for business. I'm a pretty altruistic foofy foofy. Let's all love each other guy.

but if I can't make payroll, all my good ideas aren't going to matter anyway. So I think that this one you have to be a little careful with. do I believe a CEO Cfo's function is to make money. Yes I do cuz you can't do anything if you don't and I love business.

It's like sports like I want to make money I don't think it's a bad thing I think like anything in life when it gets out of balance You're vulnerable and I think the world has become incredibly red and Incredibly blue and I think all the magic is purple. There's a lot of purple in this room, which I like I'm I'm obsessed with purple is it you? My favorite color is green because of the New York Jets But but I've become incredibly fascinated with purple as the world has become incredibly fixated on being only either red or blue. and I I think that's a big mistake. Um, lots of people know you from social media.

You have got a huge following. Um, and on social media. So I watch it and I'm like, oh my gosh, he said that and you are unashamedly out there. You say what you, what you feel and sometimes it's uncomfortable to watch.

Yeah, but I guess that's what you want in a way. Are you saying what people feel or is it just not. You're not saying it to make anyone feel uncomfortable. you're saying I'm definitely not saying it to make people uncomfortable.

Yeah, but you're just saying the facts. this: if you want your business to do well, you got to do this. This is not working I am saying the thing that I feel in my stomach could provide the most value to the most people at this exact second. And so because I read so many comments and emails I tend to have a good pulse.

I Think it's one of the biggest mistake that content creators make. They don't engage or read the comments or engage so they lose touch with I know people who say you need to delete all the comments or they don't want to see anything negative. Well, that's because they're incredibly insecure. Yeah I actually spend a lot of time thinking through when I get negative feedback I'm always scared to get too high on myself.

so I'm checking myself I'm like, are they right and often times they're not. They're just I mean think about the life of someone who goes around to someone else's content on the internet and says negative things I'm not mad at that person I feel sad for that person I actually have a lot of compassion for people who are incredibly negative online. They're using that as their outlet for the pain that's in their stomach. Um, but I Just say the things that are are very clear to me with the hope that it provides value for someone.

Did you see that just flash up as soon as you said that? Yes, 10 minutes to finish? Is that Okay, so please looking to the teacher: what's on the cards for Gary and the V X brand? Um, obviously they're two separate entities for Vayner X My marketing holding company I'm going to build the largest marketing company in the world. Um, so that's good. Yeah, and that will, but that will take time, but that's my goal. Um, I'm always planning on keeping it independent I didn't know anything about Madison Avenue or agencies I Didn't realize the reason there wasn't really great ones is because as soon as you get great a little bit, you sell to Wpp or Romcom orist and so the holding companies take the good ones off the table because the entrepreneurs that build them want the money I Got lucky I didn't want the money I Wanted a marketing company for myself to do my other behaviors I Used my marketing company to help build Resi which is a company I built and sold I Used it to build Empathy Wines which is a company I built and sold I'm using it to build Vriends.

you know the talent from it. Went to Vend so I kind of needed it as my operating system. so I plan on doing that and then for me, you know it's hard because I'm a counter puncher meaning I'm not if I was a boxer I'm not Mike Tyson I'm not attacking something and going at it I was I'm more Floyd Mayweather I'm watching what's coming at me and I'm adjusting. So I don't know what technology is going to come up next year or what might happen in society in four years, but I'm gonna see it because that's what I do and then I'm then I may do something about it and so I have no clue what I'm what business I may start or what I might go after in three or four.

When the Nft thing happened I had no idea that I was going to start my Pokemon Sesame Street brand called be Friends. that was not what I was planning on doing, but when I saw the opportunity of this new platform, I was like Hey I've always wanted to do something like this and then I spent the year thinking and building and that's how I got there. So and is that exciting for you to sort of just going the flows? Yeah yeah, it's incredibly, um peaceful. It's very nice.

Uh I know I use a lot of sports Anales: I apologize. It's what I know, but sometimes you hear from a A obviously in this country, a football player, a basketball player. You know where they talk about how? that're almost inevitably they talk about why are you so great and they talk about that moment where the game slowed down and what they're referring to is actually they're just Pro processing and and are physically faster. For me, business and life is slow I can just see it all.

It's easy for me to move in it. so what of? It's incredibly peaceful because I'm never caught off guard. Well finally, you are in a room full of Business Leaders here. If there's just one thing they should take away from our chat today, what would you want it to be that regret is poison that if I could wish anything on this audience or the one that's listening at home besides health for them and their loved ones, it would be for them to get the clarity at this exact second that this is the piece of content that gave them the clarity that almost every decision that they make in life, definitely professionally and predominantly, if not definitely in their personal life should be to mitigate regret in their 80s and 90s.

I Think way too many people in this room have compromised being happy or going after a goal to check the box on paying a mortgage or being practical when if they had the humility to take a step backwards including things like selling a home to pay off the mortgage and keep the extra profit to go rent an apartment so that he could quit their job or change course and go at something that would bring them. Joy Until the world redefines success in not materialistic things in money, but to being joyful and happy for as much of a percentage of their breathing time as possible, we will continue to make these Mees missteps And so the thing I would leave you all with is go spend more time with people that are 80 and 90 that are not your relatives and and talk to them and you will clearly see what I just talked about the last two minutes is the number one thing that you should focus on every day of your life and that about fear. It's all fear and the tough one about taking a step back like selling your home and the only reason somebody doesn't do that if they even realize to do it to get get happy is they're scared of the Judgment from the people in their family or their friends. Oh, you're so not successful that you had to sell your house or you're so crazy.

you're going to start this. Pie Company When you have this great job and you're selling your home to do it, how could you do that to your children when people don't realize houses are too big and if you move into an apartment, you're more likely to spend more time with your children, It's even better. I'm serious about these things like we have so many things is wrong.